Herseth @ 100: In Conversation with Friedman and Hagstrom

On June 15, 2021, Frank Villella, director of the Rosenthal Archives of the Chicago Symphony Orchestra Association, sat down with Principal Trombone Jay Friedman and Second Trumpet John Hagstrom to discuss their friend and colleague, Adolph "Bud" Herseth.

The recording of the conversation is here:

A few edited highlights from the conversation are below.

Villella: There are a lot of really good trumpet players out there and a lot who have enjoyed long careers. For someone experiencing a vintage CSO recording for the first time, how would you explain Herseth’s significance and what made his sound special?

Hagstrom: I was about fifteen years old and I can tell you that what captured my imagination was the immediacy of the sound, the energy and the direction. That he could capture your imagination and hold you and lead you. It’s a powerful sense of confidence of course, that goes into that, a powerful sense of physical mastery, and a certain kind of contextual blend. He wasn’t dominating in a way that didn’t have a perfect balance within the group. While he was really iconic, it wasn't to the exclusion or without immediate consideration of everything that was going on around him.

Friedman: One of the most amazing things about him, I've realized after all these years (because I played with him for forty-two years. I'm the luckiest man in the universe, sitting next to him!) is I was always amazed at the discipline that he had when he played. The whole orchestra would be playing a fortissimo tutti, and there was a huge amount of sound, and he'd be sitting there, playing exactly the dynamic that he needed to be heard and to soar over the orchestra. How do you do that? That's a God-given talent that's so rare.

Villella: Please describe your first impressions of Herseth: the first time you heard a recording, the first time you heard him live and the first time you heard him as a colleague.

Hagstrom: The first time I played with him as a colleague was at Ravinia and it was Bruckner Nine in the summer of 1996. When the big first tutti of the first movement happened, I stopped playing. I couldn’t believe it, in terms of the force of energy, of course, the whole orchestra. It was little surreal because I had studied him so carefully, along with so many other people, so to be alongside of him was a real honor. But you have to play too! Now it was my job to contribute to this.

Friedman: He was the easiest player that I’ve ever sat next to as far as being able to follow and know where the beat was. There was no doubt where the pulse of the orchestra was when you sat next to him, because it was right on the conductor's beat. He was so rhythmically solid. He was the easiest person I’ve ever played with. He also had one of the greatest ways of articulating notes. It was so exquisite and pristine. My teacher had that, I've always tried to get that and all of the principals had that. Dale Clevenger had it, Arnold Jacobs had it, all of the CSO principals had a way of starting notes where the sound literally jumped out of the horn. That's the secret to the sound of the CSO brass. 

Villella: In the seven recordings of Mussorgsky's Pictures at an Exhibition, how do you think Bud was able to achieve a different effect and a different sound for each one of those recordings?

Hagstrom: Herseth would always say that the best conductors were those that met you half way, collaborative conductors, not that we're just going to re-make you exactly the way they want it. And so, we have to remember that part of his sound on those recordings was his contribution, and so he's being influenced by Solti, influenced by the various other conductors. He was definitely following and trying to please them, but it wasn't entirely their construction of what he sounded like. Those recordings vary in tempo, they vary in the clarity or the shape of each of those notes at the beginning of Pictures. Bud was never that exhaustively specific about speaking in regards to some of these things, but we do know is that he always intended to tell a story when he played. 

Friedman: I don't ever remember any conductor telling him how to play the opening (and I'm on six of those seven recordings!). He played the way he felt it and it was always so good that the conductor was usually happy with the style.

This article also appears here.